The Acaeum Dungeons & Dragons
Collecting Forums

Evidence of Value
Post new topic Reply to topic Page 1 of 1
Author


Active Collector

Posts: 37
Joined: May 30, 2007
Last Visit: Sep 21, 2011
Location: WI

Post Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 7:34 am 
 

How do you guys leverage your collections? If you can provide evidence of value for insuring, can't you also obtain a loan on such evidence?

Are offers valid as evidence of value, such as Frank is gathering on manuscripts in his warehouse post, which may have no comparable value or recent sale value?

(I'm not assigning Frank a mysterious motive. It just crossed my mind as an interesting exercise.)

This would be an interesting topic to have addressed alongside the Front Desk articles on grading and evaluation. With a large collection able to be valued at the price of a small house in today's market, one would imagine it smart to leverage and earn income off of a collection. Just how does that work?

  

User avatar

Long-Winded Collector
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 3718
Joined: May 30, 2007
Last Visit: Aug 04, 2026
Location: USA Georgia

Post Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 8:21 am 
 

To gain evidence of value for insurance purposes, I believe you have to take the collection to the FLGS (your local store) and have it appraised.  Of course, finding someone competent could be an adventure in itself.  There are three comic book/gaming shops in my town and I doubt any of them could properly value my D&D collection.  Anyway, I would assume a similar method would be necessary to determine value.

Now, onto the topic of leveraging for financial gain, this personally does sound like a good idea in today's market.  I'm not sure it's a good idea ever.  The main reason for this is, if you have a collection so valuable that it has to be insured, then that means you are paying for insurance which means that needs to be subtracted from any gains which means you are not really making that much money and may even lose money when the market is weak or negative.  Plus, what happens if the collection deteriorates or is stolen or is burned to a crisp?  The real loss though is the loss of sleep and time.  If you have a collection because it's "fun" then processing the paperwork and the insurance and the investments just took all the fun right out of it.  

I personally have a collection of comics, minis and D&D stuff worth about $5,000.00 and if it's gone, it's gone.  In fact, I plan on selling some of the comics as I finish reading them if for no other reason than to get the value down.  My kids would rather have the money and no one needs the hassle of unloading a large collection.

The bottom line is that I believe collecting should remain fun and investing should be separate.  I have mutual funds and the 401k stuff, and they allow me to sleep peacefully at night.   It may appear "smart" to leverage a collection, but I personally wouldn't.  O.K. End of rant.  What anybody else does with their collection is their business, and I'm not telling anybody what to do.  8)


Truth is worth finding and life is too short to work for money.

  

User avatar

Sage Collector

Posts: 2736
Joined: May 31, 2007
Last Visit: Jul 09, 2026

Post Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:36 pm 
 

I would never do such a thing for one simple reason: if I leveraged it, and had a bad period of finances (everything is fickle,) I would not want my collection lost or taken from me. Someone's signature here is extremely accurate, paraphrased: gaming can get you through bad times, even when you have no money.


Those who can, don't. Those who should not, do.

  

User avatar

Long-Winded Collector
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 3601
Joined: Dec 20, 2003
Last Visit: Jan 13, 2026
Location: Canada

Post Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:46 pm 
 

I am not so concerned about what it is worth.  For me it is a hobby and not an investment.  

Lets face it, collecting is a stupid investment anyway.  It is hardly liquid, very difficult to value, difficult to store etc.  Most people who "invest" in obscure stuff like RPG's will be sorely dissapointed when it comes time to sell.

just my thoughts :)


Games can get you through times of no money but money can not get you through times of no games!!

 WWW  


Prolific Collector

Posts: 721
Joined: Aug 28, 2007
Last Visit: Dec 31, 2021
Location: Brooklyn

Post Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 2:38 pm 
 

Look at the value of vintage video game systems... Atari 5200s in the box with boxed games go for less than $50 now. Used to go for well over $150.

As we start to die off or stop fueling the vintage RPG fire it will go down too.

 WWW  

User avatar

Prolific Collector

Posts: 658
Joined: Sep 14, 2005
Last Visit: Apr 05, 2026
Location: Seattle, WA

Post Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 5:12 pm 
 

TheMilford wrote:Look at the value of vintage video game systems... Atari 5200s in the box with boxed games go for less than $50 now. Used to go for well over $150.

As we start to die off or stop fueling the vintage RPG fire it will go down too.


While I agree that vintage RPG items will lose some value over time I don't believe that video games are a good analogy.  

While I will always have a soft spot in my heart for the Atari 2600, I will also freely admit the game play sucked.  The games coming out today are generally far more enjoyable and eye catching.  Other than nostalgia there is NO reason to buy an Atari 2600.  

I will freely admit a bias towards vintage RPG items but I think you would be hard pressed to find any gamers who have been exposed to basic D&D or 1st edition AD&D who think it sucks.  I would say that OD&D sucks based on the technical merits of rules.    Even people who play 3rd or 4th edition D&D can still have fun playing through modules that were originally designed for earlier editions of the game.  

I doubt kids who grew up on XBox would find Asteroids interesting for more than 30 seconds.

I think the value of vintage RPG items will hold and even continue to increase until around 2040.  This assumes the average male has a lifespan of 75 years.  I think the vast majority of interest in vintage RPG items is from males who were in their teens and twenties in the 1970s and 80s.  Most of these gamers will still be with us until 2040 and we be becoming increasingly financially secure.  Couple roughly steady demand and ncreasing assets with a decrease in available items due to destruction and items disappearing into vaults there is little reason to think the bottom will fall out of the market in the very near future.  

After 2040 I think the value will start dropping significantly.  There will be younger people who start collecting from a historical perspective but they are very unlikely to be as motivated to pay the prices demanded today.


"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats."
--H.L. Mencken

  

User avatar

Verbose Collector
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 1110
Joined: May 14, 2008
Last Visit: Aug 05, 2026
Location: West of a site called "Chicago" . . .

Post Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 9:50 pm 
 

Blackmoor wrote:I am not so concerned about what it is worth.  For me it is a hobby and not an investment.  

Lets face it, collecting is a stupid investment anyway.  It is hardly liquid, very difficult to value, difficult to store etc.  Most people who "invest" in obscure stuff like RPG's will be sorely dissapointed when it comes time to sell.

just my thoughts :)


Unfortunately, I think my game collection has held its value better than any other investment I've made in the last couple of years.   :cry:  8O

But in all seriousness, I'm not buying FRP stuff as an investment either.  It's the fun of the hunt, and then having a piece of the history of a hobby I grew up with.


"Parturient montes, nascetur ridiculus mus."

  


Prolific Collector

Posts: 721
Joined: Aug 28, 2007
Last Visit: Dec 31, 2021
Location: Brooklyn

Post Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 4:01 pm 
 

I need to have my stash appraised for insurance.

Do you think Troll & Toad may do this for me if I send them a list? I figure the have the most inflated prices so the list values would remain "current" for a long time.

Anybody have experience with this?

 WWW  


Grandstanding Collector

Posts: 5923
Joined: Nov 16, 2002
Last Visit: Jul 31, 2026
Location: Wichita, KS, USA

Post Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 5:50 pm 
 

I'm sure Aaron @ NK would also be able to provide some insight here.  

IIRC, there was some insurance discussion over @ ToT too??


Allan Grohe (grodog@gmail.com)
Greyhawk, grodog Style

Editor and Project Manager, Black Blade Publishing
https://www.facebook.com/BlackBladePublishing/

 WWW  


Long-Winded Collector
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 3807
Joined: Feb 23, 2005
Last Visit: Feb 12, 2025

Post Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 6:16 pm 
 

I simply told my insurance agent (Allstate) what I wanted it all insured at as a whole.  It was no problemo.


Let mirth prevail!

  


Prolific Collector

Posts: 721
Joined: Aug 28, 2007
Last Visit: Dec 31, 2021
Location: Brooklyn

Post Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 7:01 pm 
 

We have State Farm... the dude said I need to itemize collectibles with an appraisal from a store or receipts showing what was paid for each item.

 WWW  

User avatar

Sage Collector

Posts: 2736
Joined: May 31, 2007
Last Visit: Jul 09, 2026

Post Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 7:17 pm 
 

I'll just take mine to Crazy Egor if need be. ;)


Those who can, don't. Those who should not, do.

  


Prolific Collector

Posts: 721
Joined: Aug 28, 2007
Last Visit: Dec 31, 2021
Location: Brooklyn

Post Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:19 pm 
 

serleran wrote:I'll just take mine to Crazy Egor if need be. ;)


do you think I could send them a list for appraisal?

 WWW  

User avatar

Sage Collector

Posts: 2736
Joined: May 31, 2007
Last Visit: Jul 09, 2026

Post Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:30 pm 
 

Maybe. The funny thing about that is getting conditions -- what one might say is near mint another might say is only excellent. So, scans would probably help even better. I don't know how much time he has for doing such things, but he might do it... for a fee, I'd imagine.


Those who can, don't. Those who should not, do.

  

User avatar

Long-Winded Collector
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 3718
Joined: May 30, 2007
Last Visit: Aug 04, 2026
Location: USA Georgia

Post Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 10:45 pm 
 

serleran wrote:Maybe. The funny thing about that is getting conditions -- what one might say is near mint another might say is only excellent. So, scans would probably help even better. I don't know how much time he has for doing such things, but he might do it... for a fee, I'd imagine.


Heck, get Tonya to come on over in her chain mail bikini. 8O   Of course, you'd be blind afterward. :lol:


Truth is worth finding and life is too short to work for money.

  

User avatar

Verbose Collector

Posts: 1655
Joined: Mar 08, 2008
Last Visit: Aug 02, 2026
Location: Toronto, Canada

Post Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 10:53 pm 
 

I recently went through this exercise with my insurance agent (Stafe Farm).

Bascially, I could name the amount to insure as long as I used a consistent method... either aquisition or replacement amounts.  I keep a spreadsheet with purchase prices that established the insured amount.

The key, though, is which rate is used to calculate the premium.  There is a steep difference between types of collectible... Rare books are charged at $50 per $10,000 value, per year.  Other collectibles, like cards or comics, are $200 per $10,000.  There wasn't a rate for game-books as such, so we had to ask the underwriter for a ruling; sure enough I ended up with the higher premium.   :cry:

If I had it to do over, I would just apply for coverage for my 'rare books'     :wink:

  


Prolific Collector

Posts: 721
Joined: Aug 28, 2007
Last Visit: Dec 31, 2021
Location: Brooklyn

Post Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 11:12 pm 
 

yeah I told him I had "rare books"... that's what they are, right?

I also have almost $20,000 in musical instruments I need to insure... but that's what I get for being a lefty and into obscure vintage models...

I guess I just have "rare" tastes.  8)

 WWW  
Post new topic Reply to topic Page 1 of 1